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tunafishjoe (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
The island analogy isn't valid. In the Libertarian model, if Ron Paul chooses not to take part in the group, then he isn't entitled to the groups winnings and vise versa. And your statement, "either the community suffers, or the individual suffers" is inaccurate as well. The two scenarios are not independent. Suffering is subjective, and can only be defined on an individual level. Financial suffering? Emotional suffering? Group suffering? Suicide is a good example...
Aeghamedic (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Who wouldn't want to wear a helmet on a motorcycle?
Hermunkle (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Watch those matches Strawman
Alan Bronfman (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Currently, about 9 percent of older Americans fall below the poverty line, based on the official definition put out in September 2011, but that number did not factor in everyday costs such as health care and commuting.At age 65 or older has a net worth 47 times greater than a household headed by someone under 35, according to an analysis of census data released Monday.Again this is not a measure of wealth and the ability to pay.
Alan Bronfman (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Bankruptcy exemption for FloridaPrimary homestead 100%, furnishing $11,525, auto, market value $3,450, IRA $1,171,650.Prepaid hurricane savings, medical savings, college trusts, gov pensions, Vehicle health aids $1000.Alimony, child support, death benefits, annuities, disability benefits, fraternal benefits Wages $3250/m
Alan Bronfman (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
The 12% in that statistic excludes their SS income from the calculation, so poverty level plus the excluded income. Incomplete and inaccurate. Also are you quoting only looking at income, not wealth. Personally I don't know any elderly that aren't wealthy. Also they have children and grand children that provide for them. They have established community that supports them. Bankruptcy can be difficult, but there are personal wealth exemptions and isn't a bid deal personally.Insur is 4x for old
C0nc0rdance (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
"Rare" isn't a great description for the elderly poor. According to SSI census data, about 3.4 million people over the age of 65 live below the poverty line (about 12%). It's estimated that without Social Security, that number would be 40%.There's been a rising incidence of bankruptcy among the elderly: 433% increase from 1991 to 2007 among the 75-84 age group, 150% for seniors in general. Health care costs are easily double for seniors as compared to younger people.
Alan Bronfman (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
The rare elderly poor? Worked for 40+ yrs, no assets, no family, no community. Statistically he has been mental ill or disabled and is a ward of the state. The rest of the poor. They should be offered wages(not foods stamps or welfare) in exchange for labor, which they can use to pay for their heath needs. Education so they are upward mobile.
Alan Bronfman (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
A person would get care for what they could afford, they would choose. The health provider would offer choices and costs to the patient.Insurance is for catastrophe. Savings/annuity is for everyday healthcare needs.A healthcare business should budget in some non-payers. It's foreseeable to handle 0-20% non-payment and can be offset by PR and donations.
C0nc0rdance (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
What should happen to the elderly poor, in your model? They have incredibly high costs, no ability to pay and no private insurance worth mentioning.Should the physician make treatment decisions based primarily on ability to pay? Rich people get the good drugs, poor people get less than standard of care? |
